Thanks Tomas, again for great info that comes from a university who did thorough research, I feel sad you never got a reply from wood database. The density you mentioned is 967 – 1045 kg/m3, that’s even a bit more dense than the piece I have with 952 kg/m3. Comes very close to the minimum density you described though. It’s indeed extremely hard and I can’t think of a harder wood in Europe. I remember someone describe it once hard as nails.

Hi Willem, I’ve been in Crete 10 years ago and have picked up some oak wood (curved piece) which isn’t holmoak but has a similar coarse grain. It’s much lighter in weight, do you know what this is? It’s been 6 years since my first comment and I find it strange the density is still listed as 800 kg/m3. I measured a dried piece that I have and that is 952 kg/m3. Significally more dense than the description but also much lighter than the 1150-1200 kg/m3 you estimated. That seems a bit too heavy to be true imho. No holm oak is as dense as ebony but rather close to that of boxwood. But density differs and depends where it grows and how fast. Also the pictures from wood database do not look like the typical holm oak I know. I therefore wonder if Eric used holmoak from the Mediterranean, where it’s most found. The photo shows the dark brown heartwood color you described, I guess this look more like Cretan holm oak? I hope Eric can adjust at least the density as this is not accurate. I see many people commenting on this. More typical holm oak photos would be appreciated as well, not saying it isn’t holm oak but just not typical.

Hi Tim, I’m a retired wood consultant, originally from the Netherlands but awhile ago when we retired we moved to Crete, Greece — Chania prefecture. There’s a lot of holm oak over here. It sure is a lot harder than any other European oak, possibly with the exception of Quercus coccifera which looks quite similar [talking about the wood]. It takes on a glassy polish, will readily sink in water no matter how well dried. Formerly [and to a limited degree, still] used for mallets, cogs in cogwheels, and other mechanical applications. The trouble is, it’s very hard. So sawmills don’t want to saw it, generally. Over here I get mine from a fuel wood dealer who knows what I want [having been his customer for 8 years]. It can, sometimes, have a chocolate brown heartwood over 10″ across. Moreover it is very resistant to cracking. That said, it does not tolerate ‘speeded-up’ drying. If you are as lucky to get hold of it, saw it into quarters and take off some of the bark. Leave it alone for a couple years. If you’re in more of a hurry you can saw it in quarter sawn boards right away, use oaken stickers, and be very pleased to work on it ;)
Cheers — Willem Hurkmans

Hi Harold… I live in Chania, Greece, having moved here nearly 10 years ago when we had the option of prepensioen. The local holm oak is way heavier than what is described; one — admittedly rather fresh — piece weighed in at 1.45 kilo/liter. When well dry — that takes a lot of time — the weight by volume will still be very high, estimate 1.15-1.2. The local holm oak has the reputation of not cracking; but you have to slowly air dry it.

Well spotted. I live in Greece within the natural area of distribution where Holm Oak does not show growth rings. Moreover it can have dark brown, extensive, heartwood and be a lot heavier by volume than what is stated. It takes an incredible glassy lustered polish, it’s less prone to cracking compared with Holm Oak grown in the UK. Traditionally it ‘s used [in Greece at least] for wooden mallets and for cogs in wind and water mill cogwheels. The offcuts make very good fuel.

Bowl

Thanks for looking into that . yep it might be Holm, but ‘if’ it is Virginian is there a way to prove its Virginian /Live and not Holm. is there anything other than vessel distribution that distinguishes the two apart.

The photo is of a bowl I turned from driftwood found on Lyme Regis Beach . it had obviously been in the sea; on the sea bed for a long time, wonderful evidence of Teredo navalis bore holes.
I am trying to prove whether this is local Holm oak or Virginian Oak from maybe driftwood Beach Gorgia curtesy of the Gulf stream .

in reviewing other endgrain images of holm oak on NCSU’s Inside Wood, I can see that there are instances when holm oak can be more diffuse porous like your images. Definitely within the realm of possibility that yours is still holm oak.

i’m mot a wood technician but rather a designer-maker. i just made a box for the ashes of my mate jerry out of holm oak that we got from a local park back in 2015, hence reasonably well seasoned as it was cut into 3/4″ planks.

from working with it, i can say it machines as if it were even harder than english oak, it feels even denser and the silvergrain is quite magnificent

unfortunately, given its use this time, i am not going to be able to keep an eye on how well it ages but i would be interested to know more re its suitability for cabinet making….. does it have a tendency to split as it dries out fully in a modern, centrally-heated home, for example?

a link to the information paper from the Polytechnical university of Madrid, Spain. http://oa.upm.es/30638/1/maderasFRONDOSASespa%C3%B1a.pdf